Please note, this is an automated transcript so it is not 100% accurate.

Guy 00:08
There we go. We’re recording Vicki. Welcome to the podcast.

Vicki 00:12
Thank you guy. My absolute pleasure and great honour to be here with you today.

Guy 00:16
Yeah, no, I appreciate it. I’m so excited. And just to put it into context, context for everyone, you know, we were having a conversation or you came to a recent retreat the five nights the first time we run it, actually, which was fantastic. And, and having to got you to know you over the months of last year. It was nice to finally sit down I think over one cup of tea one evening, I think we were chatting or lunchtime, I can’t remember. And, and, and you were telling me your journey. And I was simply blown away of everything, basically. And I asked you if you’d kindly come on the podcast to share and you said yes, which I’m very grateful for. And here we are today. So so we want to get into it. And I thought it’d be nice place to start is because you came throughout 12 week programme where we meet every single week, and you came to that, through that journey that led you into the retreat, but I thought it’d be a nice place to start up. Why you decided to jump in at that point with us how you find?

Vicki 01:21
Yeah, surely. I jumped in earlier than that I jumped in. In June, a friend introduced me I was having a lot of trouble. I was in a deep back base, and there’s a deep depression. And a very lovely friend introduced me to live in flow, he just rang up one night and said, You need to go to this and sent me a link to your retreat, which was on in August, that was obviously cancelled to the COVID. And since I was cancelled, I got an email to say, well, you can join our four week programme. So I did the four week online programme. It was amazing. It was a huge help. When that finished, I sort of felt a little bit lost. Don’t know what to do. And then thankfully, you had this four week programme on Office. So I immediately signed up for that. And it was really life changing for me, guy, I can’t express how much it changed my perception of life and got me out of that deep, dark will of despair that had been wallowing in

Guy 02:23
what way were you in that deep, dark? Well, at that point, and I just want to give a mention to Brendan savage who recommended you to us because he’s been on the podcast himself. Yeah, that’s his motorbike accident as well. Yeah,

Vicki 02:36
I have so much better when introducing me to you guys. Yes. So the reason I was in this deep type of question goes back to 15 years ago. Now, the good thing is, in a couple of weeks, my husband died. And we’ll go into the what happened and my amazing, incredible husband soon after his death, I struggled for a long time. We had a three and a half year old son at the time of his death, and Finland, my beautiful, beautiful young man has grown up into this amazing human being. And I’m so grateful every single day, I have so much love and gratitude for just the fact that he is in my life. And I really do think that he was delivered to me from the angels as a gift, knowing what I had known my journey that I had to go through that he was given to me to help me get through this process get through the journey. But then it was the reason that I was in a slump 1540 and a half years down the track from my husband dying is that he then my son, Finn was grown into an adult, he’s turned 18 And all the sudden, redundant, he doesn’t need me anymore. And yeah, I’ve been dealing with so much. He was really my lifeline for so long. He’s what kept me going, what kept me together. And just that sense of him. And he got a job, this time taking the carpentry apprenticeship, but the friend is doing lots of things. We’ve always done everything together. We’ve always had such a really, really close bond with things on some amazing adventures together had a wonderful, beautiful life. And I felt that he’s spending more time doing his stuff, which of course he has to do, because that’s his journey. And that’s what I have led him to become this wonderful, independent young man. And I’m so proud of him. I’m proud of myself too, because that was my major achievement, I think. And, but then I’m stealing art. No, I don’t know. I just put me in this really that deep place of despair. And then Brendan said you need to do this. You need to join us in front of the retreat. So yeah, and then that’s my journey. And I guess I should we start from 15 years ago than

Guy 05:01
100%. Yeah, because your husband was an adventurer. And, and funnily enough, I heard the story and watch the documentary even, you know, before meeting you many years ago, which which I was blown away by the whole experience. So yeah, please start 15 years ago.

Vicki 05:21
Yes, sure. My husband was an incredible man, I feel so deeply privileged. And every day I’m full of gratitude for just having him in my life. And I still strongly believe that he is in my life, and we’ll delve into that a little later on, but he was an adventurer, and life is pretty exciting with him because every day was an adventure and he was the true essence of living in the now. You know, he was incredible that he just lived in the moment. But he had done many things done many mountaineering adventures in had an accident. Climbing down on Bernie Borge then passed Colburn one day and smashed his name or maybe that’s the end of my climbing career. We did one more expedition to Pakistan after that knee injury but then I introduced him to kayak and then his mother at the time was really grateful to me you know kayaking so much more safe and secure the mountain the hearing there’s much less risk involved a little does she know so then Andrew has been a true adventurer and it’s really taking things to the limit and just really exploring the limits of his personal being and just the you know, stretching what what is his mind and his body and his essence capable of they started out you know, just we just paddle up the coast and do various trips, has mania Kangaroo Island different things, paddled in Patagonia. stunnel have fun trips that were personal trips, but he’d been on everyone competitor in the post. What about doing longer distance pedals. So first went across best straight, a lot of hikers do the eastern route, best straight, that’s a common thing to do. He then tackled the western route of best straight, there’s a couple of big crossings an 80 kilometre crossing and 100 kilometre crossing on that western route. And I thought, okay, oh, that was pretty good. Easy enough. No one’s ever gone straight across the middle of best straight in a kayak. So he then was the first person to paddle across the best right? It took him 36 hours or something? I think so. You know, he’s having all day and all night, had some really amazing hallucinogenic sort of things happening on that trip. Better than I was a journey, I think. Um, and then he thought Okay, so what’s next and you looked at a map and Andrew and a map was always a little anxiety inducing for me every time he picked up a map and looked at a map. I could see the cogs turning and what is going to come from this and then from that, he thought I know both interior and high X 570 kilometres. I’ll have to work out how to sleep in the car. Obviously couldn’t handle non stop that time and there’s no way to learn in between.

Guy 08:29
So this is from New Zealand to from Tasmania to New Zealand.

Vicki 08:34
No, no, this is across the Gulf of Carpentaria just in the north of Australia from Okay, pedalled from dive can point to nellen. Boy. And then so when he came back from that, well, he ended up in hospital because he had a lot of salt sores, and he was very dehydrated from that. But I spoke to him on the phone and he said, Hmm, I’ve never done anything like this again. But yes, sure. Because I knew the main way to weld and I knew that surely, that’s not going to be the end of it. Because I did go back a little on our honeymoon repairs having done in Tasmania, and I could see him you know, sort of camped on shouldn’t on and I think on Christmas Day, is looking longingly over to the east into that vast expanse of ocean and I thought Yes, big ocean kayak. Andrew, what’s he gonna do with that? No, I say that golf trip, he decided that after a day of recovering in hospital yet, I think the Tasman is doable. So the Tasman in a kayak has never been peddled before. There is a man a friend of theirs that has made three attempts, and each time he came back within 24 hours of paddling but Andrew truly believed that was possible. It was a massive undertaking. So He was planning to leave from Fortescue Bay in Tasmania and pedal below the 14th parallel. So that’s more like the Southern Ocean rather than the Tasman Sea, across to Milford Sound, and a chip that he was expected to take 30 days give or take 30 days in a car. So he had to then work out a better system for sleeping in is higher than what he did across the Gulf, because he made this little sort of like a curtain thing that pulled across when he ducked. He pulled out the bulkhead. The the ball hit Sunday could slide down into the kayak to sleep. And this is just a regular hire a regular seat. So that that he paddled across the Golf was about four metres I think roughly. So for the Tasman, obviously, he needed more supplies, he needed at least 30 days of food, he packed 40 days of food initially, he had to work out how to do everything had to live in that tiny car, he had a custom made pocket was actually bigger than the pocket pet across the goal of portraits and from Mirage coats very generously. And with a lot of angst, I must say, a lot of thought involved in in whether he should actually do this the responsibility of building a correct for this potentially dangerous journey. So he built this modified kayak there was a bit bigger as being 6.4 metres. And as only wide enough to like just listen to people listen six centimetres wide, long enough to set it could slide down into it. And high enough, the deck had to be raised a little just suddenly couldn’t roll over to the height of his hips open roll over to sleep at nighttime. So it’s confined in this little thing is sort of got his arms crossed like this, because there’s not any room to lift his arms over here. Sort of like a mummy, or in a coffin. like to say that, but you know, it’s just an image that comes to mind very, very claustrophobic. I had to work out a way to keep the, the ocean. Obviously, in that 30 day journey, the weather was going to be a massive, massive factor, because you’re looking at the Southern Ocean, and you can get extremes of weather patterns. And he did endure a couple of force 10 storms, which is incredible, massive, massive. So it’s unbelievable that that he could survive in this little car in this, you know, yachts had been wrecked and her son in

Guy 12:50
how would a kayak survive in force 10. I mean, that’s massive swell, massive winds.

Vicki 12:58
It’s massive, massive, massive and in a my heart. My heart flutters just at the thought of that, you know, just my heart starts to constrict just the thought of it. So anxiety inducing, but I guess the fact that the cracks are small, gives it a bit more leeway. So what he had he constructed in him, he devised this setup himself. He was very ingenious, my husband not only incredibly, physically talented, as far as you know, doing these extreme adventures, but really creative and very just tech, technically minded. So you could devise this setup where he made this sort of pod thing that sat on the back hatch had a couple of steel pivot arms and he reached back at the end of the day and pull it over his head slide down in the blood over that it had clamps on it was all wood approved, it had a ventilation hatch on it, so could breathe in. And that was his little like Bumble of life if you like. So the card itself is small the bubble was sitting on I maybe 60 centimetres, probably not that high of above the the, the thick of the client. But still, you know, in the storms, he would have been rolled many, many times but it was so frightening and it just would have been lying there. His arms crossed, and just going with the news locked in, clamped in this little shell and just riding out the storms in the kayaks is being tossed and buffeted around. And yeah, obviously on the really, those days he didn’t have to just talk to themselves in time. He did pedal in some pretty well conditions, and he did report a couple of capsizes which is pretty terrifying to think that you’ve kept sighs in Ixys but you know, he he survived through all that. So it wasn’t enough credible undertaking, there’s much written and much discussed about the risks involved in the responsibilities of an adventurer. And you know, the thought of risk taking. And we can get into that a little later on, if you like. But basically, there’s a lot of anxiety in the build up, there was a lot of angst, a lot of questioning, is this actually possible? Can it actually physically be done? And then Andrew decided is more. It wasn’t so much of a physical challenge. Yes, it would be physically extremely demanding, excruciating. But there’s more of a psychological challenge. So really, it’s just all in the mind, whether you can sustain that paddling day after day, after day with very little sleep, as you can imagine, locked into this little Kayak or the little coffee and being tossed around in the middle of the ocean, you wouldn’t really get much sleep, and it’s got to do everything you know, it’s got asleep to do the pollutions is going to just eat is going to just, it’s going to desalinate water. You had a manual desalinated that took half an hour to pump, one litre of fresh water. So you can imagine that he’d been paddling all day. And then is that a pump is water to disseminate it for drinking and eating out in the cooking is food and everything. So a lot of extra calories expended and effort expended just in that act, that act alone of desalinating water. So, yeah, such a huge, huge undertaking, as far as when you consider the risks of all the mountaineering expeditions he’s done. And then this this far exceeds that. The risks and the danger, I think, is so out there, you know, he’s, you’re at the mercy of the city, you’re at the mercy of the weather at the mercy of those incredible rough conditions. Having said that, he did report and luckily, some of the footage was salvaged that have some amazing footage of him, interacting with incredible sea life and reporting that whales were swimming right next to it, hear them. When he was in bed at night, tucked in in the kayak, you could hear the sound of the whale, he saw these massive massive sharks do somersaults in front of them. He was just purely immersed in the sea and all the wildlife and just in such an incredible experience, something that you could never even imagine the experience that he went through. So the highs and lows of that journey would have been just so incredible. Unimaginable. Anyway, so that there was a lot of scepticism, initially as to whether it could be done. People thought we’ll it’s not really possible, but it’s Andrew McCauley. And if anyone can do it, Andrew can do it. So he was developing quite a reputation in the adventuring world. And he’d won the Australian geographic adventure of the Year Award. He won several geographic awards. Yes, so as he was approaching the coast who had gone through these horrific sort of three weeks probably such high tension and drama and his daily reports indicating huge weather storms and capsizing and all these amazing things that were happening by about the third week is three quarters of the way there, the energy and the excitement was palpable as my email has been flooded every day with emails of encouraging encouragement and congratulations, thank you is nearly there is nearly there. And then he was always really worried about the approach to the New Zealand post because the topography as you approach that west coast of New Zealand is such that there’s lots of troughs and it creates very unstable sea conditions and so a lot to contend with the tides and the the waves and he was really uncertain and unsure and there wasn’t a lot of information about the the conditions that he might meet approaching the New Zealand coast. Anyway, things are going well we Finn and I went over to New Zealand And as interesting as we were flying 40,000 feet above the Tasman looking down or looks very benign down there and build other know that it was the seas were very, very rough that day that we we flew over here. But we arrived in Queenstown and set up base camp there a way to awaiting his arrival and the plan was that we’d head down to Milford Sound a day or two before his arrival, just you know, we’d wait and see what his tables look like how his progress was going. There’s no internet or no phone reception down at Milford Sound. So we’d go there at the last minute. And Paul, from Mirage kayaks that made the kayak he was over there with me had a Jen who was filming making the documentary, Jen Hayden, she’s an incredible filmmaker. She’s the award winning filmmaker. I feel very honoured that she made the documentary. We were all over the following his daily reports waiting for his reports every day. The night that we arrived in New Zealand. There was a massive storm and his shed, his daily schedule report was late. And I was just frantic with I was in a state of just shopping terror, just knowing that the seas were really bad. And that they were weather consultant Jonathan Bojay is French yachtsman, he was doing all the weather consulting brand new and he was texting in the forecast every day and he’d already text that, you know, you need to be aware that this low pressure systems coming through. And then when his report was late, I was just in a state of panic. And then everyone was ringing around any sign any news? No, nothing. I ran Jonathan Bojay to discuss the weather conditions just wanting a bit of comfort that’s not really as bad as you said is it? He’s well, he didn’t say that it wasn’t as bad as it was. Anyway, eventually the report came through about midnight it was such an I can’t tell you the anxiety that night and then I was just overwhelmed with relief and he said all okay, we’ll send the his coordinates in the morning because obviously had a pretty rough night and he wasn’t in a condition to just end he had a GPS tracking system unfortunately that cocked at about a four which is Yeah, and we had issues with maritime safety say no, you got to tell him to come back and there’s a lot of issues with that anyway, we overcame those but basically we just ignored them. Anyway so we thought okay, got through that message storm, although pasted a little damage to Kasperek broke a pivot arm on the on the cord that the bubble and buddy said that that was gonna be okay. So then we moved on to Tiana which was closer to Milford resituated there. And he said the set phone his last remaining set funny had three set funds to them and cocked it. He had one lift, and it was running low on batteries and he didn’t think he could recharge the batteries. So we may not be heard from him. So we decided we he said he’d be in by Sunday morning. 9am sharp, which is a bit funny because Andrew was never very punctual. So for him to give at 9am sharp bit ironic. Anyway, so he moved on to Tiana awaiting or not sure whether we hear from him or not. And that was on Friday, the ninth of February. This is 2007. And we were all sitting in the cafe eating dinner that night and Andrews father and sister had come over as well as we had quite a little support crew there. And then everyone’s funds went on. And it was the New Zealand search and rescue corn insane. They had a on Channel 16 a distress call and wanted to know what Andrews callsign was. And they said is theirs. They had a distress distress call from Chi One, two. Yeah, that’s Andrew. And I said it was a muffled message. We don’t know anything else. But we might send out a rescue. And so you know, send out a search crew. And so far that’s all really weird and we thought maybe it’s just him is set fun. must have died. And he was obviously within sight of land so that he could communicate with the VHF radio. So he would have had to be within sight of land for that communication to occur. So we took it as a good sign figure in his just alerting and all, all communications, all American communications go through channel 16, that’s emergency channel, but then they get switched to whatever channel they need to go to. But the initial message was this is Chi one. And then I was told that the rest of the message was muffled. So we thought it was a good sign. But then John C wood from the Rescue Coordination Centre rang back a little later and said, we have more of the message. And I’d like to play it to to see if it can identify Andrew’s voice. And he played a very muffled message. And it was it sounded like someone was drunk and they did say he did say they get a lot of hoax calls. And I did actually have reason to believe that somebody could have been making a hoax call. And I did that. And so when I listened to the message, and I put on speak fan, so Andrews father and Paul good listen, and they both said authentic Tim Sandberg someone’s drunk, and he replayed every rebated replayed it. So now, I know I’d spoken to him the night before. And he did sound very muffled because he’s speaking to a double dry bag. So the sound was very muffled. So I thought now I do think it’s him. So they sent out a search. And I just thought I don’t. I was very confused. And because I thought wouldn’t really he wouldn’t be calling for a risk. I think it’s a misunderstanding. And because he played such a short snippet, it was hard to tell whether you know, it didn’t say anything about needing a rescue. They sent out the search and rescue. We went down straightaway the next morning to Milford Sound. And then I went out in a news helicopter. To look for Andrew we didn’t seem we went out to the to the coordinates that RCC had their dead reckoning. But Paul had actually made a better deck dead reckoning from his last position. And he told the RCC but they were searching in a much lower latitude. And anyway, when we came back from the helicopter ride out to look for him looking in the wrong spot. I didn’t think there was any big deal that we didn’t seem as though he’s merrily paddling along. He’ll be in tomorrow, he’s gonna be so annoyed to know that there’s all this fuss with a search out for him. So we went back to our there was one at that time, there was one eating establishment in in Milford Sound was so we’re all there, having our dinner that evening. And then one of the police in the search and rescue payment. And so means that we’ve had a sighting fantastic. And said, I’ll get back to you. And we went back to the hotel all excited and Finn was so excited. I’m going to see daddy tomorrow, I’m going to see daddy tomorrow and I couldn’t get into sleep. And they at Milford Lodge, they have a generator, the generic electricity and they turn it off at 10 o’clock at night. So all the lights Good to see everything but we were just couldn’t get into sleep and the generator was still humming, the lights are still on. Time is happening, the generators still going. And then there was a knock at the door. And I’m starting to get really really anxious now just talking about this. There’s a knock on the door and in payment policeman and within a woman and the policeman identified himself as gender from town and police. And a woman Margaret from Victim Support said, what’s she doing here? And he said the car has been found. Your husband is not with it. And then the woman came in to give me a hug and I pushed her away and I said no, no, that’s not him. That’s not his choir that you go out and find him. That’s not his quiet. It can’t be him. And yeah, that was when I feel it died inside. And I just had no sleep and Finley was bawling and we just I was bawling my eyes out and just get in declaiming. I can’t even remember anything better not actually. I just was comatose. And the next day we went back to Ghana because there’s no there’s no communication available there. So went to Tiana and waited for search as they search for Andrew. And Paul was trying to give them his dead reckoning and with where to search, they’re still searching lower. And then that, Nick, they continued to search for that was Saturday. A man from the Australian High Commission got involved. He came in and visited me and said though, he’s pushing the paper search underway. They the New Zealand authorities wanted to finish the search. And he argued for to keep searching. So they search for another day. On the Monday night. They asked the family together around and then Todd Holloman, surgeon, at Tianna police station came and said to me, the search is over. Your husband has not been found. And that was when I truly died. I lost my husband but I felt that I died as well. And my heart just shrivelled up and I just collapsed. And I know nothing that the days following that.

Guy 31:58
Thank you for sharing Vicki. Really appreciate it. And I know it’s been obviously it’s a challenging time, like you said, and you were in that place, you know, from you sharing that story, we can all connect instantly now like the son being 18. And, and ready to, you know, leave the roost and step into his manhood and and, you know, like you said being left in, like shit, what about me kind of thing? You know? Yeah. And yeah, from there, it really puts everything into context, what you’ve just shared and and, you know, going back over these things. Yeah, concern and reflecting can certainly be challenging. You know, it’s, it’s, I want to ask a couple of questions with with you if that’s okay. Because now knowing what your journey because a lot of things happened after that. And they you went on and created a book,

Vicki 32:59
I believe. Yeah, yes, the documentary was made gently. Well, it was interesting. Well, that that night when the police pulled off the search, and the police, I must say, news, I love New Zealand and the love all New Zealand people. They’re so amazing. They’re so gracious. They’re so full of love and compassion. And the whole community, they’re rallied around us. And I can never express my gratitude enough for all that community, and particularly the placement who have remained in contact with and feel like, you know, we’ve developed a very strong friendship. So I said to Finn, who was the one that actually was winched down to the helicopter down to retrieve the pilot. I said to him, I’m going to write Andrews book for him. So I wrote in his book

Guy 33:55
bootiful solo

Vicki 33:57
solo. That was a heart wrenching journey for me writing that book. But it was also my catharsis. And it’s also something that I felt was necessary, because Andrew did have the contract to write the book. And when I approached the, the editor, I said, I’m going to write a book for him. He was very reluctant in, in fact, he said no, to start with, but I was quite persistent. I said, Actually, I feel that I can write in some ways a better book than what Andrew is going to write because Andrew was writing from a pure adventurous perspective. But I can write from that perspective. And I had a lot of video footage that I transcribed into the book, and a lot of his inner thoughts and you know, there’s a lot of delving into the, the, you know, what makes an adventure and what mindset does an adventurer have because clearly, they don’t think the same as nonperson. But I also felt that my having my perspective in the book is the wife of the adventurer and, and the perspective of the people that are left behind, you know, that adventure, of course, is high risk. And it’s always a big question. Is it worth the risk? And yet, some say, it’s an interesting thing, because after the documentary, and after the book, every day has been flooded with emails and support from all around the world, and people expressing their their gratitude for the book and the documentary, because it’s been such an inspirational story. And then, as far as those people are concerned, yes, and just Jenny was worth it, because it provided such inspiration for so many people, it is such an inspiring story and, you know, to, to, to go beyond what what is humanly possible, it just teaches us all a lesson. But for those that are left behind, ultimately, well, of course, no, it’s not worth it. Because I’ve lost my husband is lost his dad or his family, and we’ve lost that. And just parents have lost their son on and just friends have lost their wonderful friend who’s just an incredible person. But it’s also just a matter of I just want wanted that story to be told from Andrews perspective, and from my perspective, and the perspective of the process of grieving, because that’s a really big thing. And I’ve also received messages of thanks from people that are not interested in the adventure side of the story, but in the the process of grieving and how that’s helped other people that have suffered a loss. And how just reading about that, that process of how do you get through the great intellects also, I think, was one of my aims in writing the book. And so ultimately, I convinced Tom Helia, the editor that yes, I could write a good book. And I must say, I’m extremely proud of the book, I think it’s an incredible achievement. I’m very, very proud of myself.

Guy 37:27
That’s a huge achievement. It’s, it’s amazing what you’ve you’ve created and be able to keep it all together, like you said, and to produce something like that of the back end,

Vicki 37:39
and also a great legacy for Finn. And that’s one of the reasons that and Finn fact, in fact, has only just recently read it. And when he finished, yeah, when he finished his money a few months ago, he finished it. And he came in just Mum, I am so so proud of you and dad would be so so proud of you. That was worth it.

Guy 38:03
Yeah, amazing. Amazing. You’re making me cry tears. So let’s get there’s so many questions. I want to ask you already about that. But I have no doubt a lot of it will be in the book, and things can is triggering, but because I want to bring the podcast in the second half and just aware of time into into your journey as well now, because, you know, you’ve had some incredible shifts over the last few months and connections and feelings and emotions. And I’d love to dive into those things a bit. From there, because when you when you started working with us, I don’t know, do you know what to expect at that point

Vicki 38:49
that I had no idea. I had no idea what to expect. I just thought well, Brennan told me to do this. And he just threw me on the deep end. I thought okay, I’m open to anything at this stage because I clearly need help. I clearly cannot go on I you know, I do feel that I have achieved a lot a lot in those 14 and a half years. And I had done a lot to instil a great sense of, of independence and courage and compassion in my son. So ultimately, the whole journey was worth it because he’s just anyone that knows him will say is just the most incredible human being. Yeah, nothing. And then, when we started the four week course started to really delve into my inner self and then realise, well, you know, Andrew was doing this all along. That was his journey. He was just really been present to the moment. In fact, I’ll just transgress a little guy and just go back to his journey and someone had said in one of the many interviews after he done, the Gulf crossing, someone said how pedal for that long day after day. And you know, how do you keep going. And, of course, this was more pertinent for the Tasman crossing, because that was 1600 ohms, as opposed to the 570, the golf, and Andrew just said, day by day, hour by hour, minute by minute, he just breaks it up, and you just be in the now. And, and I’ve also asked him to NEC in the sometimes the you know, he breaks it up into hourly, lots, but ours can be too big. So he breaks up into five minutes and five minutes can be too big. So you just have to be so present in the moment. And that’s what this is all about. That’s what I realised joining this amazing live in flow community. That’s what that’s the essence of everything has been in the now.

Guy 40:51
Yeah, yeah. Because we always say just to give people context that myself Matt and Petra, when we come together, we just Door Man, we open the door and give you the tools and allow you if you’re willing to step through that door. And take take charge of yourself, of what we show you in terms of tools and experiences, then, then things begin to shift, you know, and so it becomes the it’s on the person to to ensure that they are ready to take that step, move through and then actually start to do the work, which is clearly what you were doing, you know, from the moment, you know, you just grabbed this by the bit . And went with it

Vicki 41:34
I just I sure did, I just grabbed it and ran with it. Because I you know, I thought this is it, this is my make or break point, I’ve got to do something. So it’s, it’s the four week course really made some important shifts, and I made some important discoveries, when you know, the first stage in your flower flow is awareness, just becoming aware of my thought patterns aware of what is happening in my head, day to day or minute to minute even, and then catching all these thoughts and, and breaking it down. And, and at one stage I went through a phase that I realised that actually I was angry. I went through this phase of anger and that anger is one of the many stages of grief and anger is something that, you know, who can say how long grief the whole process will take. You know, I’m still grieving, I’ll be grieving until the day I die. But you know, it’s a matter of the levels of grief and your acceptance of the process of grief. So I finally got to this point of anger and anger. A lot of people were angry back when Andrew died, because it was so irresponsible of him to leave a wife and a small child and how dare he do that journey. And I was never angry with him. Because how can you be angry with someone that is so passionate and so driven and so alive? You know, he’s so so alive. And he can’t be angry with that it can’t be angry with somebody that is so passionate about following their dreams. So I never held that anger to Andrew. But then once Finn was coming into adulthood, and I felt so totally out of my depth with how to handle that, you know, going through all the stages and his growth happened to I’m way above my out of my depth here. And I don’t know what to do. So now I’m angry. And now I’m angry that you left me now that I’m angry that I’ve got to deal with this on my own and how I do that. And I thought okay, well, anger is a better place to be than then that dig that depression because anger has an energy. Depression has no energy. And then I think that that stage of anger that I finally got to, after all these years, gave me a stepping stone because I gave me the energy to then push through and get over that. No, that was just a short phase, you know, staying angry with Andrew for too long. And I just have so so much love eternal love him. But then I started to have these incredible experiences and oh, I firstly, yeah, I went to psyche after so many, you know, I’ve been thinking about for many years, but I don’t know, just getting involved with the live in flow thing. I thought, Okay, I’m just gonna do this. I contacted a psychic. And it was incredible because like Andrew was in the room with me. I was having a conversation with Andrew. And one really, really important thing that I discovered. Not only that, he’s always here with me. He’s watching and he’s watching everything is always supporting us. And he told me that you just got to listen and look because I’m here all the time. You just need to be more receptive to the signs. And because I’ve been stuck in this grief, I wasn’t open to it. But anyway, as I will thing that had always tortured me was what actually happened that night on the ninth of February 2007. And I asked what happened? How, and and then it kind of at that, I think what happened was he actually had a heart attack. And that, in fact, gave me because the coroner’s report said, you know, he was capsized by a big wave, and he was washed from his kayak and drowned or died of hypothermia and drought. But through this communication with the psychic determine that, actually, I think he’s had a heart attack, which makes more sense. And for me, it gives me some relief, because I’d always thought of him out there, perhaps listening to the rescue helicopters, but then not seeing and how traumatic would that have been, it’s kept me awake for years and years and years, just the thought of that. And then to know that he had it how to take it was all very quick and sudden, that was such a huge relief for me. And I think that allowed me to open up to things. And then my heart started out in and I started becoming more receptive. And then I had this in the process of the tool, we cause we do this gratitude way, we write a gratitude journal. But I’m not. I don’t recall whether it was actually that week of gratitude. But I woke up one night in October, November, pyschic. And then in November, I woke up in the middle of night at 222, in fact, and the whole room was glowing, this white ethereal light, and it was so incredible. And I was just overwhelmed by this feeling of gratitude, gratitude, and do gratitude for Finn gratitude that everything in my life, good or bad that had happened. And I just this, the whole room was a light glow, my heart was just expanding into my chest, so overwhelming. And I’ve held that sense of gratitude ever since then. And it was such a powerful moment. And that I’m sure it happened because of the work through the process of the living flow work. And then, on the retreat, I had an even more profound moment we’d had on Monday, I can’t remember what day it was maybe day two with the sound healing session with Matt and he talked about before these things happening, some people see rainbows and fairies and unicorns and shit. And

Guy 47:43
she has. Yeah,

Vicki 47:46
that’s weird. And so I thought, okay, like, I’m really open to this, but I’ve been feeling really, after that amazing opening that gratitude moment, my heart then started to restrict, again, I felt this really strong compression. And when during that sound meditation, the compression got stronger, like it felt like somebody actually put their hand he was squeezing my heart was very painful. And that happened in that meditation. So whereas I didn’t have this wonderful experience, I had this really negative experience. And I express that in the group afterwards. And then that afternoon, or the next day or something we did that group energy healing thing we’re around in a circle is eight people in circle and one person gets chosen and I was so thankful and grateful to be chosen to be the receiver of the energy so all the group is giving their energy and online they’re receiving this energy and can I describe what happens is very visual.

Guy 48:50
Absolutely.

Vicki 48:52
So and, and it comes back to that thing that Matt was saying about your theories and nickels and shit. And and I was lying there, nothing and nothing much is happening and starting to feel a little bit of a buzz and I get this energy when then when I know Andrews around so I can feel this palpable energy running through my hands and through my body. And I started feeling that tea with me is his head. I couldn’t really feel the energy of the group, but then it started to get stronger and stronger. And then I had this incredible sensation of I’m still really tight in the chest at this point. And then this really weird thing happened online then I suppose. A A unicorn horn. pierced my chest came from a bat pierced my chest. It’s this pearlescent ethereal, glowing white unicorn horn. And it came out of my chest burst my heart open. And then at Kenyon Thai unicorn, and it actually had wings. So it wasn’t really for me. It was a cross between a unicorn and a hybrid unicorn Pegasus. So these beautiful white wings to expand it over my entire group. And then beyond the grip to the whole octagon that the room that we’re in at the retreat, and then beyond that, and these massive wingspan, it was so vivid and powerful and my heart was so light and everything was blowing why. And then the unicorn hybrid unicorn Pegasus flew off into the distance. And then the scene was replaced by this really calm ocean. And it still had that ethereal glow, and this really like glistening, silvery white glow this ocean. And it was very smooth. And then a kayak came along, there was barely a about way from the kayak was so smooth. And then Andrew was in the car. There’s someone else, I think it could have been thin. I’m not sure I didn’t see the person in front. But I could definitely see Andrews face very vividly. And then he morphed into a dolphin. And he leapt out of the fire and did a backflip and landed in the water. And then I came and jumped in his seat in the kayak. And then as we paddled on whoever’s in the front, and me pedalled on into the distance and the cut in the dolphin. I Andrew did one more big flip, and then disappeared. And then so as the kayaks just heading on into the sunset, and then your voice in the background, your voice was very, very faint in the background. Okay, so the receivers now open your eyes, and I just burst into tears, I just overwhelmed with this incredible, powerful love. And I was so overwhelmed with love and joy, but I was bawling my eyes out and I couldn’t stop. And then Judy, one of the people in my picture, laid it out, let it out, just let it all go. All in my eyes out. And I was just I was sobbing, sobbing sobbing, I couldn’t stop and I was just wet with tears. And then I think I heard very vaguely your voice saying, Okay, everyone received a stand up. And I thought there’s no way I can stand up. But I opened my eyes and everyone in my group. Look, I looked up into everyone’s faces, and they were all angels, and looked up into these faces and angels. And they’re glowing. This just beautiful, beautiful love. There’s so much love emanating from the people in my group. And I just said come down to me. So we all come down into this big group huddle on the floor, and we’re just all hugging us reaching out and touching their faces and increasing Oh, I love you. I love you so much. We are the sort of complete strangers, you know, and then there’s people for two days. And there’s so so much love was so powerful was so so beautiful. And it’s just the most profound experience. And I’ve just my heart is so open now I’m so receptive to love and joy and bliss. And I’m just it’s been tears me just the thought of it. And these are not tears of sadness. They’re tears of joy and happiness, because I never thought that I would experience such strong emotions. But it was just the most incredible.

Guy 53:12
Wow, you know, I knew you had a hell of an experience. But I didn’t know the details. So that’s the power of a podcast, isn’t it? Thank you for sharing it, Vicki. And that’s an that’s the power of love. Right? Like, oh, it’s absolutely, it’s not some nice thing to talk about, like, as human beings, it is a divine right to to know that we can experience this that we are capable of this. And we can actually support one another for the for the good. And the better as well. You know, exactly.

Vicki 53:43
And it’s just that connection to guides is that sense that we are all one we’re all connected. And we’re there’s so much love out there. And we just all need to connect and we need to be open and embrace it.

Guy 53:56
Yeah. It’s incredible. How have you been feeling? Since we’re, you know, we’re probably a month on now. Nearly. Yeah, on the podcast.

Vicki 54:05
Yeah. Interestingly, slight cough. This is the residual COVID caught. When I got back, I had a couple of days with my beautiful sister in law. And then my sister. And I told them my amazing experiences to treat up the north coast before I came home and I contracted COVID up there. And when it came from, I was sick for a couple of days. But I had to isolate for the seven days I thought, well, actually, this person is a blessing, because it’s giving me this opportunity now to I don’t have to work, I don’t have to go back to work. I’ve just got to be here and be so present in the moment. And I can really reflect on the whole experience of the retreat and what I went through. And so I thought that was wonderful. Unfortunately, after seven days, I sort of had a relapse and I got sicker than I did in the first place. So then I was quite sick. But I still thought okay, well that’s supposed to happen. and it’s you know, it’s meant to be that I need more time to process the thing, because it’s such a huge thing, that the whole retreat at that that moment in particular, was such a profound moment for me, and such a life changing moment that I think I needed really this these last few weeks to really assimilate all that, and what does it mean? And what does it mean taking it forward in my life, but so I haven’t gone back to work yet. I did go back to work tomorrow, for the first time. But I’ve just even I’ve been quite sick this last week in particular, I’ve just been really so calm, and just have this overwhelming sense of love and gratitude. have held on to that it’s amazing. Good or bad,

Guy 55:55
you know, and but little do we know that we can actually have experience that is so divine, so so incredibly powerful that it can, it can shift something within us that for the better, permanently moving forward. And then this shifts the very lens, we look on life and the fact that you what made me smile, and it’s like you said, you came back your caught COVID. And you saw it as a blessing. And, you know, purely because you’re in your heart, you’re open. And you see there’s an opportunity there to maybe have a different perspective, and come from a very different way. And I think that’s the beauty of this work that we all have the opportunity to shift our perspectives and come back and start living more from the heart. Yes, just knowing how to do it.

Vicki 56:44
Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So go to the retreat. That’s how you do it.

Guy 56:49
Yeah. Last question. Last question, Vicki, just to wrap things up on where the time, but what would you say to somebody that’s listening in on this that might be sitting on the fence or is just in a place where they are struggling? You know, if for whatever reason? Yeah,

Vicki 57:09
well, Andrew had the same as actually Henry Ford, same, but Andrew used all the time. Whether you think you can or you think you can’t, you’re right. And that was his mantra. And that became my mantra, too. Because, yeah, if you think you can do something, you can do it. If you think you can’t, well, yeah, of course, you’re not going to be able to do it. So it’s all just your your perspective. And Andrew believed and I believe that Andrew could cross the Tasman be the first person to cross the Tasman in a sea kayak in this tiny little vessel. And there’s wild raging sea, he believed that he could do it. He got within sight of shore. So in my mind, he did it. He was the first person to cross the testament. So he believed I believed, whether you think you can or you think you can’t. You’re right. And I also have another quote from Teddy Roosevelt, that, you know, at the retreat, we had the pick of wood, that we are something I am and I chose courageous because I feel my husband was such an incredibly courageous man. And I had to deep dig so deeply to find my courage for these last 15 years. And I feel very strongly that I found it in that profound moment at the retreat. I found my courage them. And Theodore Roosevelt had a quote spares something like courige is not going on, when you have the strength. down something, characters not having the strength to go on. It is going on when you don’t have the strength. I think that’s true. Because, you know, I’ve, I’ve had to delve deep to find the courage to keep going on when I did not have the strength. Every day I had to wake up every day I had to get up and look after my little boy and nurture him and care for him. And I didn’t have the strength to do it. So that is courage.

Guy 59:19
But don’t from the outside looking in the amount of courage you have Vicki, because stepping into this work, especially when you’re in a place of grief and anger. And coming into it stepping into the unknown takes huge amounts of courage and what’s been evident the whole time as I’ve gotten to know you and witness just observe you on our journey is that you you’re constantly been showing up for yourself and taking the steps and continue to leaning. Which Which it does take courage and for me to be sitting here with you on the podcast, listening to your journey and story in detail. I feel very privileged having to get to know you, Vicki, and you’re going to be a huge light shining light for other people, which is evident as well from the the courageous steps you you take in your life. So I just want to say thank you. What an amazing meeting.

Vicki 1:00:16
It’s been my great pleasure, Guy. Thank you. Thank you. Thank. Thank you. And thanks, Madam pitcher for all the work that you do. And it’s honestly been a lifesaver for me. That’s incredible.

Guy 1:00:29
If people want to get your book or watch the documentary is, they’re all available.

Vicki 1:00:37
Well, the books actually out of print at the moment that I am going to arrange a reprint of the pennant. Milam aren’t going to reprint it, but I’m going to go through another small publishing house. So I don’t even really have a website or anything at the moment. It’s all work in progress, just things that but they can contact me by email, if anyone’s interested that documentary. I think we might be able to find it on one of the streaming channels. It’s still around, it still shows sometimes on SBS that you know they do. But it’s still very much as before it was an award winning documentary, so it’s, he should be up to good mood.

Guy 1:01:20
That is all right, if I pop your email in the show notes, and then people can reach out and contact you. Yeah, so everyone listening if you want to contact Vicki, the email will be whether your YouTube Spotify, iTunes, or on my website will be there beneath in the show notes. Beautiful. Thank you, Vicki, thank you so much. And

Vicki 1:01:40
thank you guys, absolute pleasure.

Guy 1:01:42
You’re welcome. Much love